From Luke.Stark at mathworks.com Mon Jan 21 16:38:09 2008 From: Luke.Stark at mathworks.com (Luke Stark) Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 16:38:09 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. Message-ID: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? One wonders. Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. Have a good day! -L -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080121/dc42a7c6/attachment.html From stephen.sykes at maxisat.fi Tue Jan 22 03:07:56 2008 From: stephen.sykes at maxisat.fi (Stephen Sykes) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:07:56 +0200 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> Message-ID: <6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> Hi Luke, We are still around (Anders and me) but I guess we do not find the time to work on Madeleine. I do use Madeleine for some simple tasks. But I find that often I need to use a database - because I need all the manipulation tools that come with that kind of data store. It would be nice to return to Madeleine and improve it one day though. Stephen On Jan 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Luke Stark wrote: > I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be > appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed > because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? > One wonders. > > Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't > have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. > > Have a good day! > > -L > _______________________________________________ > Madeleine-devel mailing list > Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/abf62592/attachment.html From ndrsbngtssn at yahoo.se Tue Jan 22 04:42:53 2008 From: ndrsbngtssn at yahoo.se (Anders Bengtsson) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 09:42:53 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. Message-ID: <630273.55395.qm@web25505.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Hi Luke, It did reach a point where it was "good enough" for most purposes. The features waiting to be added are bigger things. Parallellizing work for higher throughput (there's a proof-of-concept for that in the contrib directory, but it's almost a re-write), a Rails adapter (far from trivial), etc. For me personally, I haven't been able to use Ruby that much professionally, so I haven't had the opportunity to use Madeleine much. /Anders __________________________________________________ Anders Bengtsson ndrsbngtssn at yahoo.se Stockholm, Sweden ----- Original Message ---- From: Luke Stark To: madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:38:09 PM Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? One wonders. Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. Have a good day! -L __________________________________________________________ L?na pengar utan s?kerhet. J?mf?r vilkor online hos Yahoo! http://shopping.yahoo.se/c-100390123-lan-utan-sakerhet.html?partnerId=96915014 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/00169efc/attachment.html From Luke.Stark at mathworks.com Tue Jan 22 07:14:35 2008 From: Luke.Stark at mathworks.com (Luke Stark) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 07:14:35 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: <630273.55395.qm@web25505.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <630273.55395.qm@web25505.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B2527B@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> Thank you for the reply Anders and Stephen, I find Madeleine fascinating. I'll continue to try to find places to apply it and post any interesting items to this list. I appreciate the work you all have done so far. Good job. -L Hi Luke, It did reach a point where it was "good enough" for most purposes. The features waiting to be added are bigger things. Parallellizing work for higher throughput (there's a proof-of-concept for that in the contrib directory, but it's almost a re-write), a Rails adapter (far from trivial), etc. For me personally, I haven't been able to use Ruby that much professionally, so I haven't had the opportunity to use Madeleine much. /Anders __________________________________________________ Anders Bengtsson ndrsbngtssn at yahoo.se Stockholm, Sweden ----- Original Message ---- From: Luke Stark To: madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:38:09 PM Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? One wonders. Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. Have a good day! -L ________________________________ S?k efter k?rleken! Hitta din tvillingsj?l p? Yahoo! Dejting: http://se.meetic.yahoo.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/e93d6478/attachment.html From uhgall at ml1.net Tue Jan 22 09:00:20 2008 From: uhgall at ml1.net (Ulrich Gall) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 09:00:20 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: <6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> <6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> Message-ID: I haven't done any work on Madeleine, but am lurking and may be interested in getting something going at some point. I have some rails projects that keep the entire system state in memory rather than in a database, and then just occasionally write it back to disk (marshaled), and at some point it may make sense to improve this. -Ulrich On Jan 22, 2008, at 3:07 AM, Stephen Sykes wrote: > Hi Luke, > > We are still around (Anders and me) but I guess we do not find the > time to work on Madeleine. I do use Madeleine for some simple > tasks. But I find that often I need to use a database - because I > need all the manipulation tools that come with that kind of data > store. It would be nice to return to Madeleine and improve it one > day though. > > Stephen > > > > On Jan 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Luke Stark wrote: > >> I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be >> appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed >> because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? >> One wonders. >> >> Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't >> have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still >> around. >> >> Have a good day! >> >> -L >> _______________________________________________ >> Madeleine-devel mailing list >> Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Madeleine-devel mailing list > Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/82908ae8/attachment-0001.html From epugh at opensourceconnections.com Tue Jan 22 09:45:18 2008 From: epugh at opensourceconnections.com (Eric Pugh) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 09:45:18 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> <6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> Message-ID: <515CA91B-3CCA-486A-9059-D9141B9E12F7@opensourceconnections.com> So I just wanted to put in the +1 for madeline.. I've been looking at some problems where a "relational" model doesn't work well, and I really just want to deal with a bunch of PORO's.... I looked at Madeleine a while ago (maybe a year ago???) and really liked it, just wasn't sure about the adoption etc... So since there is some traffic on the list, let me just drop out my questions: 1) Will it work with Rails2 as a front end? 2) Any options around using the command interface to executing changes? It seems kind of arbitrary and icky.. I'd rather just have all my object changes via changing themselves. ERic On Jan 22, 2008, at 9:00 AM, Ulrich Gall wrote: > I haven't done any work on Madeleine, but am lurking and may be > interested in getting something going at some point. > > I have some rails projects that keep the entire system state in > memory rather than in a database, and then just occasionally write > it back to disk (marshaled), and at some point it may make sense to > improve this. > > -Ulrich > > On Jan 22, 2008, at 3:07 AM, Stephen Sykes wrote: > >> Hi Luke, >> >> We are still around (Anders and me) but I guess we do not find the >> time to work on Madeleine. I do use Madeleine for some simple >> tasks. But I find that often I need to use a database - because I >> need all the manipulation tools that come with that kind of data >> store. It would be nice to return to Madeleine and improve it one >> day though. >> >> Stephen >> >> >> >> On Jan 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Luke Stark wrote: >> >>> I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be >>> appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development >>> slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it >>> have faded? One wonders. >>> >>> Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't >>> have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still >>> around. >>> >>> Have a good day! >>> >>> -L >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Madeleine-devel mailing list >>> Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org >>> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Madeleine-devel mailing list >> Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org >> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel > > _______________________________________________ > Madeleine-devel mailing list > Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org > http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel ----------------------------------------------------- Eric Pugh | Principal | OpenSource Connections, LLC | 434.466.1467 | http://www.opensourceconnections.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/6852bdf9/attachment.html From Luke.Stark at mathworks.com Tue Jan 22 13:44:59 2008 From: Luke.Stark at mathworks.com (Luke Stark) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 13:44:59 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: <515CA91B-3CCA-486A-9059-D9141B9E12F7@opensourceconnections.com> References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com><6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> <515CA91B-3CCA-486A-9059-D9141B9E12F7@opensourceconnections.com> Message-ID: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B254C2@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> Hi Eric, I don't know about the Rails question, but it's worth exploring. As for changing your objects...the point of the exercise is that you use the command pattern to facilitate logging the actions (commands) that build up the current state of your business objects. Without using commands, wouldn't it all just fall apart? -L ________________________________ From: madeleine-devel-bounces at rubyforge.org [mailto:madeleine-devel-bounces at rubyforge.org] On Behalf Of Eric Pugh Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 9:45 AM To: Ulrich Gall Cc: madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org; Luke Stark Subject: Re: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. So I just wanted to put in the +1 for madeline.. I've been looking at some problems where a "relational" model doesn't work well, and I really just want to deal with a bunch of PORO's.... I looked at Madeleine a while ago (maybe a year ago???) and really liked it, just wasn't sure about the adoption etc... So since there is some traffic on the list, let me just drop out my questions: 1) Will it work with Rails2 as a front end? 2) Any options around using the command interface to executing changes? It seems kind of arbitrary and icky.. I'd rather just have all my object changes via changing themselves. ERic On Jan 22, 2008, at 9:00 AM, Ulrich Gall wrote: I haven't done any work on Madeleine, but am lurking and may be interested in getting something going at some point. I have some rails projects that keep the entire system state in memory rather than in a database, and then just occasionally write it back to disk (marshaled), and at some point it may make sense to improve this. -Ulrich On Jan 22, 2008, at 3:07 AM, Stephen Sykes wrote: Hi Luke, We are still around (Anders and me) but I guess we do not find the time to work on Madeleine. I do use Madeleine for some simple tasks. But I find that often I need to use a database - because I need all the manipulation tools that come with that kind of data store. It would be nice to return to Madeleine and improve it one day though. Stephen On Jan 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Luke Stark wrote: I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? One wonders. Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. Have a good day! -L _______________________________________________ Madeleine-devel mailing list Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel _______________________________________________ Madeleine-devel mailing list Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel _______________________________________________ Madeleine-devel mailing list Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel ----------------------------------------------------- Eric Pugh | Principal | OpenSource Connections, LLC | 434.466.1467 | http://www.opensourceconnections.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/1b9cf11d/attachment-0001.html From Luke.Stark at mathworks.com Tue Jan 22 13:48:24 2008 From: Luke.Stark at mathworks.com (Luke Stark) Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 13:48:24 -0500 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> <6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> Message-ID: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B254C6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> I myself have been trying to think of a use where the business object data size reaches a plateau (to facilitate keeping everything in memory.) I'm stumped. Where should we look to apply this given a locked memory ceiling? I like a good puzzle. :) -L ________________________________ From: Ulrich Gall [mailto:uhgall at ml1.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 9:00 AM To: Stephen Sykes Cc: madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org; Luke Stark Subject: Re: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. I haven't done any work on Madeleine, but am lurking and may be interested in getting something going at some point. I have some rails projects that keep the entire system state in memory rather than in a database, and then just occasionally write it back to disk (marshaled), and at some point it may make sense to improve this. -Ulrich On Jan 22, 2008, at 3:07 AM, Stephen Sykes wrote: Hi Luke, We are still around (Anders and me) but I guess we do not find the time to work on Madeleine. I do use Madeleine for some simple tasks. But I find that often I need to use a database - because I need all the manipulation tools that come with that kind of data store. It would be nice to return to Madeleine and improve it one day though. Stephen On Jan 21, 2008, at 11:38 PM, Luke Stark wrote: I'm "playing" with Madeleine, looking for places it might be appropriate or interesting within our shop. Has development slowed because it's good enough? Or perhaps places to apply it have faded? One wonders. Just checking to see if anyone is responsive on the list. I don't have any problems I need answered. I'm just seeing who's still around. Have a good day! -L _______________________________________________ Madeleine-devel mailing list Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel _______________________________________________ Madeleine-devel mailing list Madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/madeleine-devel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080122/7eb05754/attachment.html From stephen.sykes at maxisat.fi Wed Jan 23 04:36:02 2008 From: stephen.sykes at maxisat.fi (Stephen Sykes) Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2008 11:36:02 +0200 Subject: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. In-Reply-To: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B254C2@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> References: <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B251D6@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com><6C38F6D3-E914-4DF5-B512-FB3A4027E078@maxisat.fi> <515CA91B-3CCA-486A-9059-D9141B9E12F7@opensourceconnections.com> <69648CFFC930954DB229C132FEA52602B254C2@MESSAGE-AH.ad.mathworks.com> Message-ID: <475BEE08-8B88-480D-ACC8-B576BD2AC4C5@maxisat.fi> 1) Will it work with Rails2 as a front end? Your main problem will be multiple processes trying to access the store at the same time. If you only have, for instance, just one mongrel process - and you never use the console or any scripts that load the rails environment and access this particular model, then you might get away with it. In which case you would need to make a model that includes Madeleine. Of course the model would not be a subclass of ActiveRecord::Base - you could not really implement a Madeleine backend for ActiveRecord I think. But without active record you should still be able to use it fine from your rails code. By the way, you need to configure somehow a different store location for production, development and test modes. 2) It's not clear what you are requesting - it sounds a little like what is already implemented in the automatic commands module. -Stephen > > > From: madeleine-devel-bounces at rubyforge.org [mailto:madeleine-devel-bounces at rubyforge.org > ] On Behalf Of Eric Pugh > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 9:45 AM > To: Ulrich Gall > Cc: madeleine-devel at rubyforge.org; Luke Stark > Subject: Re: [Madeleine-devel] Experimenting. > > So I just wanted to put in the +1 for madeline.. I've been looking > at some problems where a "relational" model doesn't work well, and I > really just want to deal with a bunch of PORO's.... I looked at > Madeleine a while ago (maybe a year ago???) and really liked it, > just wasn't sure about the adoption etc... > > So since there is some traffic on the list, let me just drop out my > questions: > 1) Will it work with Rails2 as a front end? > > 2) Any options around using the command interface to executing > changes? It seems kind of arbitrary and icky.. I'd rather just > have all my object changes via changing themselves. > > ERic > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/madeleine-devel/attachments/20080123/70aa8945/attachment.html